I've been noticing the dealers at my local casino will allow you to keep a Come Bet up (with odds) when it wins. Can you press your Come Bet, and/or the odds when this happens? On WinCraps there's that option too. If I want to add $2 to my Come Bet when it wins, I can do that. If my Odds win, I can add $5 to that. I'm of the opinion that winning Come Bets should be turned into a Place Bet, so they don't get hit by a come-out 7, and you can hold that number out there for another win. I guess I could keep the Come Bet up but add $10 odds on each win. If it gets swept away in a 7-winner I could re-establish a Come Point and re-affix odds that I had on before the tumult. I get my odds back on a 7-winner, but the Come Bet is lost. So I'd like to focus on lower Come Bet amounts, and higher odds on a progression. If I have a $6 Come with $60 odds on a $5/10X Odds Table, I should be able to add $2 to the winning Come Bet that's up there, and add $20 odds also to make it an $8 with $80 odds come bet on the same point. I'm playing on WinCraps now. I have a $6 Come Bet with $15 odds. If I win, I add $5 to the odds. The 5 & 9 points are different and $16 odds get $4 added to them, then $5 on a 2nd win. I'm adding a Come Bet each time a Come Bet wins. But if I get a roll that wins my Come Bet, I could either take my winning bet down and re-add the odds on the same point, or just add $6 to the Come Bet point so now it's $12 with $20 odds. I think I'll take down my winning bet and re-add the odds. I won $556 in 66 rolls on WinCraps. I had odds of $30 on the PL, $20, $50, $60, and $20 odds on my Come Bets when the 7-out came. 7-winners wipe out the points I had up. Pressing on Place Bets seems to be a better way to go.
In my experience this is the most popular way to stay on a number after winning a Come bet that had it as a point. You tell the dealer as he/she is about to pay you, "Down and back for [amount desired]." This also works of course but you are in effect making another bet (called a Put bet), not adding to an existing bet. In your example, as the dealer is about to pay and return your winning Come bet you would tell him/her, "Take it to 8 with 80." With greater than 4x odds (5x on 6|8) the Put pays better than a Place, but you are forfeiting your 2:1 advantage on the comeout by skipping it and the flat portion of a Put becomes a contract bet.
I've been betting $15 PL and Come, with $30 Odds. There's been a serious lack of good luck and I lost $1500. I changed my Come Bets to a Place Bet on a win and adding $10/$12 on a progressive, then putting out another Come Bet (which usually got beaten down with 3 craps in a row then a 7-out). Maybe I need to put out a Come Bet after every other win on the Come Bet/Place Bet; or only have one Come Bet that can lose on a 7-winner. I won $500 back by just focusing on the PL and 1 Come Bet. My PL Progression is $15, $20, $25, $30, $40, $50, $30, $40, $50, $50 My Come Bet has no progression and remains at $15. My PL Odds bet progression is $30, $40, $50, $60, $80, $100, $60, $80, $100, $100 My PB progression is the same as my PL Odd Progression but the first PB bet starts at $40, except for the PB 6/8 which is $42, $54, $66, $90, $114, $66, $90, $114 I won over $750 back by hitting the PB5 8 times. Some casinos don't let you buy the 5, or they may have a $50 minimum to buy the 5.
Hi, Van, long time. I want to clarify this option of making a Put bet, compared to a new $8 come bet with $80 odds if a come point is established. The essential point is that a Put bet is an even-money bet with a disadvantage up front, because no matter what the point, the seven is more likely to show. The "mirror image" of this is to make a Don't Pass bet after a point has been established, which the casino will NOT let you do; this is cheating, called "past posting". To illustrate, suppose you just won a $6 come w/$60 odds on 5, and you tell the dealer, "Take it to 8 with 80." The dealer will give you $8 of the $96 you just won and put the $8 + $80 on the 5. So, what's your expectation? There are 4 ways to roll a 5, 6 ways to roll a 7, so: 4 x 128 = 512 6 x -88 = -528 -------------------- -16 For every ten of these, you expect to lose $16, so the ev is -$1.60.
It looks like I ran up against a character limit, so: Similarly, if your $6+$60 win was on six, you'd have: 5 x 104 = 520 6 x -88 = -528 ------------------- -8 For every 11 of these, you expect to lose $8, so the ev is -$.73. Finally, if you just won on 4: 3 x 168 = 504 6 x -88 = -528 -------------------- -24 For every 9 of these, you expect to lose $24, so the ev is -$2.67 The expected losses are based solely on the flat part, which, as the Skulker points out, is a contract bet and cannot be taken down. OTOH, if you just take your winnings and make an $8 come bet, taking $80 odds if a point is established, your ev is just -$.11. Of course, you lose the ability to pick your number and this is also a contract bet. More next post
If you make 60 of each of these, what is the expectation? Put 5, $8 + $80, 60 bets ev -96, standard deviation $820 Put 6, $8 + $80, 60 bets ev -$43.64, SD $741 Put 4, $8 + $80, 60 bets ev -160, SD $935 Come $8, 10x odds, 60 bets ev -$6.79, SD $670 Many players, in comparing place or put bets to come bets, overlook the effect of the comeout roll. Cheers, Alan Shank
You need to count the numbers of time you miss a payment cuz you removed your bets too then. Planning to remove your bets means you don’t collect enough and press too much. Need to be balanced.
All these guys keep talking about the value of the come bet. It's one roll among many and I only want one , I don't want to make points , I just want to roll a lot of numbers. Actually on a couple of my betting strategies , once I get to a certain point I don't take my bets down. I just rack the wins as they happen till I seven out. By that point I am racking a sizable amount every time the dice hit the table. If I ever pull all my bets , it is because my toss is wonky. My betting strategies all have rules , when to press and when to rack profit. I can;t press too much I can only press what I have just won / house money so the loss of a press oe not come out of my original bankroll.
Alan There are a good number of players that put great worth in the edge on the come out roll , however if you are playing a 10x odds game your come out roll with an $8 bet had an edge, however then the bet with $8 flat and $80 in odds does not have an edge. You indicated this …….The expected losses are based solely on the flat part, which, as the Skulker points out, is a contract bet and cannot be taken down. What is the expected loss for the entire session when you are taking 10x odds because as you and I both understand you can not predict when you would remove those odds. I think the come bet can be a good bet in certain situations, but not all. TDB
I feel a 10X or better game is the perfect place for come bets as long as you're going to take the appropriate odds. A $10 flat $100 odds 5 or 9 pays $160 while a $110 place bet pays $154. If you want to catch the first number play place to come.
The expected loss on an odds portion of the bet is $0....regardless if it is 2x, 5x or 10x. The expected loss on the $8 come x 60 wagers is $6.77. The expected loss on the 60 wagers with 10x odds ($80) is $0. The true power of the come bet is the come out roll. Enormous edge for the player by casino standards. I assume that is what Alan is referring to when he says place bettors "overlook" the effect of the come out roll.
missthis1 I am not saying you should not use a come bet, I am saying it is complete nonsense to use only the flat bet odds to indicate the worth of a come bet..... You make a $5 come bet and hit the 7 for a win of $5, then place $50 in odds and the number is a 9 and you dont hit it, you lost $55. The odds on you hitting that nine are no better than if you placed a place bet and maybe worse, because now you have to hit that nine a second within that roll to win your bet. I simply say be honest about what the come can and cant do. tdb
Kind of a misnomer, IMO. A come bettor is not placing a bet on the 9. He is making a come bet wager which can win or lose on the next roll (2-3-7-11-12). If a 9 is rolled, the come bet wager moves to the 9. He NOW has to hit the 9 ONCE to win the bet. If a 4-5-6 is rolled and a player is on the 8-9-10 and decides to shift his bets to 4-5-6 because he wants to "bet what the table is giving"....does he now say to himself I have to roll ONE of those numbers (4-5-6) TWICE to win? I think not. He needs to roll it once to win.
