DICE HIERARCHY

Discussion in 'Beginner Zone' started by Linaway, Mar 5, 2014.

  1. CrapsGenius, Mar 9, 2014

    CrapsGenius

    CrapsGenius Member

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    I like that K.I.S.S method. because if I over analyse my throw results and crazy random outcomes and fail, I tend to get frustrated and that gets me throwing even worse thus changing my predictions to null/void this making me want to give up and choose a new style of play.

    "Set the dice and check em to the back wall" if you didn't roll a seven, then you've accomplished what you're after.
     
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  2. Linaway, Mar 9, 2014

    Linaway

    Linaway Member

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    Well thank you Craps Genious,

    Your not the first nay sayer regarding dice setting/shooting I've locked horns with and found him not only to be wise with his play, a damned fine person. I call him my friend. Basicstrategy777. I've received some challenges on this board and when the smoke cleared, turns out there just might be a great chance for exchanging thoughts here.

    CG, I am not your run-of-the-mill dice setter seeking DI-manship. I am a whole dice advocate. I use ever wrinkle I can find in the dice to my advantage. Believe me, I have found many of them. Hence my moniker of Dice Conspirator. I've been accused of being at the top of the heap with this scenario.

    Who knows, I may introduce the board to Dice Channeling. No, this is not chasing spooks but using your personal shooting quirks married with in depth dice knowledge to make it all happen. This is not a system but a Medthodism. It works both for the shooter or the player.

    Before any of us knocks what the other does, I'm reminded of the little boy in a Life cereal commercial. It said give it to Mickie, he'll eat anything. So it should be with the board offerings. Try it, you might like it.

    Take care,

    Linaway
     
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    Last edited: Mar 9, 2014
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  3. Southern-Comfort, Mar 9, 2014

    Southern-Comfort

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    This is in reply to Linaways reply to me. Not quoting, because honestly, I'm not sure what you were saying in the first place. :) But the things I pointed out that you need to do better than before you start thinking of yourself as a possible DI, are actually the long run averages any shooter should get randomly. Check it out. If you can improve on the long range odds, you're on the way, but not there. And 100 rolls over ten days is a way of turning short run results into a pseudo-long run result.
    Not sure what you were actually trying to say beyond that.
     
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  4. Southern-Comfort, Mar 9, 2014

    Southern-Comfort

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    Come to think about it, you are correct in that two different colored die are not needed as long as you test with the hardway set. You can tell if one or both go off axis simple by the number it shows. Just I'm used to practicing with two colors so I naturally included it that way.
     
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  5. Linaway, Mar 9, 2014

    Linaway

    Linaway Member

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    southern-comfort,

    I do not follow the premise that the self made gurus have set down as being the absolute standard. I don't now nor have I ever considered myself as a DI or don't ever want to be. I do not agree with much of what the gurus are selling.

    With the premise design I have, you never have to pick up the dice. However if you do pick them up, I know and have documented ever possible twist and turn the dice can make. I can tell you the best dice sets there are to beat probability.

    I am not fixated on 16 numbers in a single axle variable. This limits you to 2.777% performance you must comply to. I'm greedy, I want everything coming out of the dice at outcome. I want 100%.

    I've asked on many forums this question. So your an on axis shooter. A roll of the dice produces lets say a 5 and you have money on it but that 5 appears as 2/3 which is in a X6 axis. Your preset was in the 3V and the haha so called primary number should be 4/1 for the 5. I have never seen or heard an on axis shooter tell the dealer do not pay me that hit for the 5 displayed was off axis.

    Me, I don't give a furry rats behind what axis an outcome is on as long as it is in the 3V, 2V or X6's. I decline to tell you how I manage these outcomes for that is
    privileged information and I will not post it on a public forum.

    As Superrick pointed at in his definitions of a DI, the test you described even he would have a problem managing it. Why, it's rediculous. With my dice knowledge I do not have to mark dice, use differnt colored dice, seek pitch information, all I have to do is read 4 die faces and I know precisely what I've got.

    If you doubt my ability to do the things I say, just ask Rick or maybe BS777. They know I don't spell bind, I tell it like it is. If you still want bona fides, go to Superricks site and see perhaps 5000 posts. Nearly 700 of them are mine.

    If you persist in doing what your doing, that's not a problem for me. If it works for you, that's fine. You see, I put up these posts as a feeler to see which way the posters lean. I suspect you have had training from GTC judging from the test you were showing.

    I once heard a metaphor that gave me delight. Why, it is to the point and it is a fit it all kind of thing.

    There is more than one way to skin a kitty without getting scratched.

    So you maintain your on axis and I will maintain my Whole dice approach.
    My guess is you don't know what I say because it's different from what you were taught.

    A paralleling story. The lab I once worked for sent me to a school teaching mass flow. I did just fine until they began tossing formulas around where none of the letter desiginators in the formulas were what I had been taught. They meant the same but were different. Once I got out of that class, back in my lab, I converted all they used to what I knew and the problem was resolved. Things aren't always what they seem.

    Linaway
     
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  6. Southern-Comfort, Mar 9, 2014

    Southern-Comfort

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    And that's all well and cool. I'm absolutely not one of those who think DI is the answer. Its edge isn't that great. At the level of wagering most people can feel comfortable with, its more like playing golf. Never become a pro, but maybe beat your friends.
    So, tell me more, in simple terms, I'm a simple man, you are one who like to spew out many when few are all that's needed and I lose my train of thought. I'm serious there.. I really do. And I want to know your method but all I hear are teasers. Are you a tease? :)
    And the numbers I offered are from excel (well on bone tracker, but bone tracker is basically using excel). All the possible sets, one by one, as the end-of-day casino term would look at it. They end up with partial numbers so I averaged to make it closer to actual.
    You wouldn't argue with math now would you? But then again, you don't worry about DI so its just an exercise in religion, and arguing will prove nothing more than if we believe or now. So, on to your method. Please explain it.. again, in simple words. Or are you here to sell it?
     
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  7. Linaway, Mar 9, 2014

    Linaway

    Linaway Member

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    SC,

    Don't condemn me yet. I wouldn't have Bonetracker on my computer. I don't lke it. Anything it kicks out, I have. Any information about all permutations I have. I even got two programs that will tell you what an outcome is or how many places a number can reside. I'm well aware of Excel and use it extensively
    for all of my spreadsheet efforts including programs in Visual Basic. I've had programs working for me long before Maddog came out with BT.

    Yet all electronics is useless in the casino. I use the computer on my shoulders which all casinos will accept. Now, what your asking me to do is give you and a public forum privileged information. The posts I put up was designed to see which way the members lean.

    Some of the members like my posts, claim they are a good read. If you truly want to know what I know, I will not just hand it over to you. I have CD's available. Hey I even design and build electronic training aids. Been doing it for over a dozen years. Only one on the planet that does this and still am.

    Read Superricks latest post in the Practice Thread saying getting worse. I feel
    so strong about what I do & I will tell you I'm as good as it gets. I've not misled the board, not pushed sales of anything. Just put up posts for the readers. You
    people keep prying so I give you a taste but will not give away my hard work.

    What do you design and build, what do you offer the board other than lip music?

    Linaway
     
    #27
  8. Southern-Comfort, Mar 9, 2014

    Southern-Comfort

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    Well, let's see.. I offered, for free (product of the 60's and a believer in the GNU philosophy) factualy information about what it truly takes before you can be honest about considering yourself a DI. Of course, as one trying to hype a different religion you attacked it. At least I think you did, I honestly still have no idea what you actually were saying. But a word of advise... blind disbelief is as bas as blind faith. Don't attack what you do not understand. I'm not exactly an idiot. I taught myself UNIX (both System V and BSD) back in the 80's. I'm retired from supervision of one of the largest telecoms in the US.. I was in the Internet department. Your computer on your shoulders is a known defective device and should not be relied upon for accurate information.
    Here's something that I kind of think you sound as if you subscribe to that, if so, we both believe. There is no real randomness. Everything is a logical reaction to an influence of something else. People do have the ability to reason, and change minds.. dice do not.
     
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  9. CrapsGenius, Mar 9, 2014

    CrapsGenius

    CrapsGenius Member

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    post some videos if available.
     
    #29
  10. Linaway, Mar 10, 2014

    Linaway

    Linaway Member

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    CG,
    Sorry, no videos. However, if your really serious about wanting a bit of show n tell, PM me, we can hook up via e-mail where attachment of files are possible. Also a bit of one on one.

    In this manner for those that are nay sayers about knowing about dice properties can get a wee taste of what they are, then how they can be applied.

    A short sampling will have the 2 of us exchanging thoughts. You see, dice smarts is not just the province of DI's. The rest of us can use the information as well. Are you up to the exercise.?

    Linaway
     
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  11. Linaway, Mar 10, 2014

    Linaway

    Linaway Member

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    southern comfort.......don't attack what you don't understand? You certainly like others digging their spurs into me have been on the attack since I came onboard. You sir do not understand what is presented. I disagree with you about the computer on your shoulders. Your electronic devices are useless at a live casino table. You must rely on your mind to lead you through the maze a craps table presents.

    What you were trying to convince me of is not what I'm about. There is a saying you might try to practice. You can catch more flies with honey than vinegar. Further, privileged information I will not post in a public forum. You want straight answers, it must be taken to the PM. I will not give away my knowledge.

    Linaway
     
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  12. Linaway, Mar 10, 2014

    Linaway

    Linaway Member

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    FOR ALL CONCERNED.

    The first comment in this thread pointed out how it might stir up the troops. Read the responses and it sure enough did. Then the comments within the thread were all valid statements. Not one individual responded to these comments but most demanded I show proof I was a DI or show me how I could become one.

    No way. These comments were there to see how many of you knew anything about the dice. My final statement obviously triggered some nerves. So again, I ask that anybody interested without a pissing contest, please review the remarks and then advise the board of what they mean to you. Play nice. You step on me, I step on you. Think about it I am not the enemy. The casino is.

    Linaway
     
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  13. CrapsGenius, Mar 10, 2014

    CrapsGenius

    CrapsGenius Member

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    Amen to that.

    The Casino is the enemy. Well said, and we figure out how to give ourselves an advantage over the casino, members start chewing our heads off.
    1) Some people just think about stuff
    2) Others physically try it
    3) Then there is us... who succeed and make the game interesting.
     
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  14. TDVegas, Mar 10, 2014

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    There is no enemy in gambling. Most realize it's a negative expectation form of entertainment and go with it for enjoyment. Then there are those that make their life revolve around trying to figure out how to gain an advantage. We see them all the time...marking down results, throwing the dice in some convoluted fashion, reading every huckster book published or thinking some past dice result is an indication for the future. They drive beat up 1982 Chrysler K Cars, live in subpar housing, eat fast food and generally live far lower than their means would allow. The regular gambler.
     
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  15. The Comeback Kid, Mar 10, 2014

    The Comeback Kid

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    If you think you're successful now, wait until you break free from the "Casino is the Enemy" religion.
    And you come to realize the Casino is the goose that lays the golden eggs.
    Therein lies your advantage, Sir.
    Amen to that!
     
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  16. Linaway, Mar 10, 2014

    Linaway

    Linaway Member

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    NON SEQUITUR
     
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  17. The Comeback Kid, Mar 11, 2014

    The Comeback Kid

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    It's beginning to sink in. Stay with me 'cause this is good.
    I believe what the "Dice Whisperer" (conspirator) is saying is look at your result from as many perspectives as possible.
    Then ascertain from the data if you're in a "safe zone".
    So you look at the other face values for any potential "trouble" and make an adjustment to your set.
    Meaning - how can you be effective in 7s aviodance; if you don't know where they are?
    (Let me put down my morning Bloody Mary extra vodka)

    For example, there goes the dice from the 3V. The result - 1/3 top view.
    Now let's do a 180 (cause 360 ain't possible at casino).
    Mmm 3/5 facing me. OK another view 6 inside under the 3, 2 outside under the 1.
    What does this mean?
    Well that inside 6 & that top view 1 could be a potential danger.
    I also see the 5 facing me & the 2 on the outside - potential red flags.

    So in my wisdom (don't ask) I switch to the 2V.
    Result: 2/6 top view.
    Facing me: 10 under the 2, and 4 under the 6. (not bad)
    Outside 4 under the 2, and 5 under the 6. (ditto)
    Again the pesky 5 & 2. (uh oh)

    So I switch to the cross 6s
    Result: 1/3, top view
    3 under the 1, and 1 under the 3
    2s on the outside of each die.
    (I think I'm safe so I'll continue with this set)

    This joyful yet, labor intensive process is the work needed to understand what adjustments, if any, are necessary to avoid the 7s.
    He did the work for himself over many years, & has come up with a set of rules, which is why he prefers to keep that to himself.
    Understandable.

    So gentlemen, rather than picking up the dice with your normal set and just blasting away, have an array of maybe 3, and
    switch between them, based on what you see on multiple faces.

    Now, if only I could find a way to SEE the damn dice; at the other end of the table...
    After that, improving my hearing - next on the to-do list!

    Soft 10? Who you kidding, I swear that's a hard 8.
    Oh for crying out loud... we all see a hard 8 down here...
    What'd you say? What's the damn call?

    Who? What?
     
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  18. The Comeback Kid, Mar 11, 2014

    The Comeback Kid

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    Ok now tell me the numbers on each side all around.
    What?
    Security? Are you kidding me?
    I'm a "Dice Conspirator", damn it!
    Get your hands off me!

    Who's on 1st
    What's on 2nd
    I don't know who's on 3rd.
     
    #38
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  19. CrapsGenius, Mar 11, 2014

    CrapsGenius

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    That's a nice read, I just stay with the Hardway set shooting left side of the stick man after a point is established. I find (for me) it's the best set for making tons of numbers and avoiding that "7" I use 4/4 top and 2/2 facing me.

    On comeout I have been doing very well with Mini-v set 6/2 top, 2/4 facing me shooting from spot 8 left side of stick man, giving me 7's on comeout by my target numbers for that set are 4 or 10.
     
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  20. James Hall, Jul 18, 2018

    James Hall

    James Hall Member

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    I like this
     
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