Is it the set or is it your release

Discussion in 'Dice Influencing' started by Dave G Ct, Jan 4, 2020.

  1. Dave G Ct, Jan 4, 2020

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    In the world of adjustments to your toss there has been a lot of discussion about changing sets to counter bad results.
    But what if the set has nothing to do with your results,? What if your release is off and of course you have no way of acknowledging it what do you do. Myself if my release is off the shot still looks great- that is why it will drive you nuts!
    I found in my case if I switch grips from a 2 finger UH to the old standard 3 finger the release is simplier. Only one way to release it.
    Then back to my 2 finger and hey it is on track again. Go figure.

    But there is NO need to change sets.
     
    #1
  2. eagleeye2, Jan 5, 2020

    eagleeye2

    eagleeye2 Member

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    Dave G. Ct.,

    It's obviously more complicated than the ""SET" or ""RELEASE"", but rather a combination of all things involved in the ""Throw"".

    This includes, but is not limited to the following:

    a) Set
    b) Release
    c) Landing
    d) Spin if any
    e) Speed of DICE
    f) Trajectory of DICE
    g) The two Angles of DICE Landing (DICE Flat Surface to Table SURFACE)
    h) Table Surface Characteristics
    i) Length DICE are Thrown down the table
    J) Dice themselves

    Yes, this is why DI is so Difficult to achieve!!!

    eagleeye2
     
    #2
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  3. Dave G Ct, Jan 5, 2020

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Great post!
     
    #3
  4. twodicebilly, Jan 7, 2020

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    Dave


    Dave everything matters, however the set should be a reflection of what your
    seeing at the table, not the other way around

    Your not going to throw exactly the same way everyday......that is the one given
    of a dice setter.

    here is an example

    say I set 6/4 4/6 and I use an inline shot,before the dice leave my hand I know where each
    of the 6 numbers are in that set.....so the first die gives me a 2...I know for sure the dice
    did not stay on the rotational plain of 6/4/1/3... I throw again and I get a 5.....the answer is the
    same and so on. Now if my first couple of hands are to short and the 7 is 2/5 or 5/2 then
    what.....you break that combination up....I rotate the front die and now if the dice do about
    the same thing...… the 2/5 5/2 seven is gone... Conversely if I use the same starting
    set and get 6/1 1/6 and have short rolls, I understand my dice are finishing on the same
    rotational plain they started on and will break that up.

    If you always know where the numbers are in our starting set and keep track of the dice
    you will always know what set adjustments to make.

    The question is not if this works, the question is are you shooting well to show some type
    of pattern, sometimes your not and your just going to lose...time to call it a day

    TDB
     
    #4
  5. eagleeye2, Jan 7, 2020

    eagleeye2

    eagleeye2 Member

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    TDB,

    I think you have missed some of yhr items below in your explanation above...

    This includes, but is not limited to the following:

    a) Set
    b) Release
    c) Landing
    d) Spin if any
    e) Speed of DICE
    f) Trajectory of DICE
    g) The two Angles of DICE Landing (DICE Flat Surface to Table SURFACE)
    h) Table Surface Characteristics
    i) Length DICE are Thrown down the table
    J) Dice themselves

    Yes, this is why DI is so Difficult to achieve!!!

    eagleeye2
     
    #5
  6. twodicebilly, Jan 7, 2020

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    Eagleye2


    DI is impossible......

    The sooner you come to grips with the notion that no human being can
    do all those things correctly and the same every time you play, the better
    chance you have of learning the things that will help.

    The guy who wins is not the guy with the perfect shot, but the guy that understands
    what he is doing and can take advantage of that.

    All those things you mentioned are items that affect what you are doing, they are not now and never
    will be a list of things that can be mastered by anyone perfectly every time you play

    Di is really no different than the random guy at the table that thinks he is on a hot roll and decides
    to bet more than normal, he is taking advantage of what he sees whether he has had anything to
    do with it or not.....the Di sees something he is doing that he can take advantage of and wins more
    because of what he sees.

    there is no absolute, but the baseball guy that hits 300 makes millions....yet he fails 70% of the
    time....your not going to bat 1000 on the craps table, but you can win more often than most people think you can.

    TDB
     
    #6
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2020
  7. eagleeye2, Jan 8, 2020

    eagleeye2

    eagleeye2 Member

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    I do not argue with your statement above, however a good Di can WIN one in three THROWS & with Appropriate Betting, will win more on that WINNING THROW than they loose on those other throws!!!

    eagleeye2
     
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  8. DeMango, Jan 8, 2020

    DeMango

    DeMango Member

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    Totally ignorant.
    Your finely tuned toss produces a set of die faces that you must track. Your computer will give you a set that will meet your needs. Ignoring the tools of the 21st century will not help you conquer new worlds. You of course don’t need to because you are not good enough to be tossed from your current home.
     
    #8
  9. DeMango, Jan 9, 2020

    DeMango

    DeMango Member

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    And after toasting Dave above, went to Heavy’s site, and Irish is toasting Dave. Something about an ancient Fire Bet win. Too funny.
     
    #9
  10. twodicebilly, Jan 9, 2020

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    eagelye2


    You could be right, maybe there is some one good enough to all the things you noted perfectly
    every time they get to the table and call each and every number they are about to throw.

    I just have never seen it, and I have seen scores of guys throw the on axis shot.. My two buddies here
    have worked on it for 12-14 years, they have 11 classes between them, had private lessons with Dom,
    each practice daily and play a lot and they cant win consistently...…..unless they adjust sets and
    at times where the dice hit the table.

    I was out of place to say dice control is impossible, nothing is, I just dont see anyone this side of
    God being able to use the shot, making no set adjustments ever......win

    Remember thousands of guys have taken classes to do exactly what you have indicated...….where are those
    winners????

    TDB
     
    #10
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2020
  11. eagleeye2, Jan 10, 2020

    eagleeye2

    eagleeye2 Member

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    TBD,

    One does not have to ""HAVE PERFECT THROWS"" to make $$$ Playing CRAPS, as you seem to infer!!!

    Key is how many ""THROWS"" does it take you to make around 20 throws, in a single try, before that dreaded (7) shows it's face???

    I say if you can do that in about (3) throws, you can make $$$ Shooting CRAPS.

    No..., I did not say it was EASY!!!

    eagleeye2
     
    #11
  12. TDVegas, Jan 10, 2020

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    While a point winner could be followed with a come out 7 winner...

    The chances of rolling 20 times without a 7 is 2.6% (MidnightS)

    You are potentially proposing to do this 33% of the time??

    I understand it's not my realm....but jeez, let's be realistic here.

    "Not easy":eek:

    Expected is less than 3 times in 100 hands...assuming no come out 7 winners.

    You are proposing to do this 33 times in 100 hands??
     
    #12
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2020
  13. twodicebilly, Jan 11, 2020

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    Eagley2

    Real long hands are mostly luck, you get the 7 at the right time and so on. You start
    talking 40-50-60 rolls that is not easy.

    On the other hand 20 or better hands are common, I would not say 33% , I sure cant do
    that, but I have a lot more than probability would suggest.

    TDB
     
    #13
  14. von duck, Jan 11, 2020

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    If a "good DI" can win, one in three throws, how many throws does it take for a "bad DI" to win? :cool: Is it like, in the billions? :)
     
    #14
  15. Dave G Ct, Jan 11, 2020

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Von Duck
    Have you tried DI. ?
     
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  16. von duck, Jan 11, 2020

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    No Dave, I haven't. I believe DI is a "placebo". But that doesn't make it completely useless. The "Placebo effect " is a real phenomenon. If a person believes something to be beneficial, their actions may be altered, in a way that it IS beneficial, even if NOT in the way that they think. I see no way that attempting DI, in itself, could be of any harm. Keep on "strokin" Dave, and if you can find a free hand, throw some dice too. :cool:
     
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  17. DeMango, Jan 11, 2020

    DeMango

    DeMango Member

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    Dave, have you tried ignore button?
     
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  18. eagleeye2, Jan 11, 2020

    eagleeye2

    eagleeye2 Member

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    von duck,

    Why not ask yourself???

    eagleeye2
     
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  19. eagleeye2, Jan 11, 2020

    eagleeye2

    eagleeye2 Member

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    von duck,

    Now you see why it is NOT easy!!!

    eagleeye2
     
    #19
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