Shackleford on blackjack

Discussion in 'Other Casino Games' started by TDVegas, May 5, 2017.

  1. TDVegas, May 5, 2017

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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  2. basicstrategy777, May 5, 2017

    basicstrategy777

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    Rather incomplete....but I guess space is limitation. But he should have said best to surrender hard 16 against 9,10, ace....and surrender 15 against a 10. Plus other stuff.

    777
     
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  3. HornHiYo, May 5, 2017

    HornHiYo

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    8. Hawking hot tables.
     
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  4. Onautopilot, May 5, 2017

    Onautopilot

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    Even though "Insurance" is a poor bet HA wise, I have on rare occasion elected to play it. But only if my bet size and hand, makes it something that I really would like to "insure", most of it hinging on my bet size. If I have escalated (parlayed) my bet to some level of "discomfort" for me....which occasionally happens, I might opt for the high HA insurance bet.......so NEVER bet it is a bit too inclusive in my mind.

    But I am not going to argue the math with that guy....in fact I use his site all the time for math clarification. :)
     
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  5. HornHiYo, May 5, 2017

    HornHiYo

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    It's sound advice for those that just play cards or follow all or part of basic strategy. Guessing what is the dealers hole card based on visible cards, last round of cards, guessing the dealer is due or anything to do with bet size is very similar to reading dice and voodoo dice play. Only a proficient card counter knows when there is a mathematical advantage to take insurance. Often the results are wrong when using a count to make a decision, but they are more right than wrong over all.
     
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  6. Onautopilot, May 5, 2017

    Onautopilot

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    Good point. And long ago, I use to card count back in the days of one and two decks. I was fairly good at it, but until the book "Beat The Dealer" came out, I didn't realize just how much I didn't consider.

    And alas, after the "book" everything started changing....downhill for the old counters, mid deck shuffles became common place, then the multiple decks.

    I gave it up as a lost cause, mainly I didn't want the hassle of the whole thing. But if I do play BJ, I still have a subconscious counting thing going on, and bet accordingly....not that it changes much, just a natural instinct for an old card counter.
     
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  7. HornHiYo, May 5, 2017

    HornHiYo

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    Hassle is one heck of a good reason in my book. And that was back when things were bad and now they are worse. In Las Vegas; much worse. Corporate has or is killing any player favorable games. Regardless many players continue to play even in 6:5 bj games. They apparently stopped researching after reading "Beat the Dealer".
    It seems Corporate has finally gotten its way in that everyone plays every game offered with a random chance of losing.
     
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  8. basicstrategy777, May 5, 2017

    basicstrategy777

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    I like to enjoy myself so I only count aces and 10's. Keep track of 10's in my head and 1 chip = one deck of aces (4) . I eyeball the discard tray to determine how many decks have been played.....3 decks means 12 aces and 48 10's should be out. if 5 aces and 20 10's have been played I know the deck is in my favor.

    777
     
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  9. HornHiYo, May 5, 2017

    HornHiYo

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    Is what you are doing a tracking system that was marketed as "Aces and Faces" or your own idea?
    I did a complete circle in card counting going from plus minus and Hilo to a seventeen count and now enjoy KO preferred; simple count, no deck estimating and no converting to TC. It is much more accurate than eyeballing and it gets the money on the table at just the right time. I love the simplicity.
     
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  10. random_roller, May 5, 2017

    random_roller

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    I played a few hands of blackjack in Lima (3:2 on BJ, dealer hand shuffle, @6 deck, 10 Soles minimum). Drew a pair of 8s against a dealer Ace, with surrender being an option. I had bet 40 Soles (@$13) so I just hit -- and drew a 5. Nice! Dealer had a A-9. Even better.
     
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  11. von duck, May 6, 2017

    von duck

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    #11
  12. basicstrategy777, May 6, 2017

    basicstrategy777

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    You see my handle. Correct play, as I'm sure you know, is you split 8's against all up cards. Also, you are probably aware that 5's cause the greatest shift in odds from house to player, even greater than aces, and counting 5's is a strategy.

    It's good you had luck on your side, it beats all.....even the math.

    By the way, that was an interesting read on your trip report. I liked it.

    777
     
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  13. basicstrategy777, May 6, 2017

    basicstrategy777

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    Hey....whatever works.

    Aces and ten's and how to track them, I don't recall seeing anywhere but I am confident it is written down somewhere by somebody. There isn't anything really new when it comes to older games such as craps and BJ....When looking at casino games I figured BJ and Craps were the 2 best ones in terms of fun and edge. I wrote textbooks on both games and taught both games. If you know basicstrategy and play it perfect the house only has a 1/2 % edge on you. RE: eyeballing the discount tray to determine how many decks have been played, believe me, I can get very close...and so could you.

    777
     
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  14. Onautopilot, May 6, 2017

    Onautopilot

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    As I remember, I used the plus / minus count....leaving the 8's as neutral. 2 thru 7 minus. 9 thru ace plus. When the plus count got to plus 3, start the higher bets, and up them as the count increased.

    But that was back in the day of single and double deck, and dealt deep into the deck.

    I did put a higher emphasis on number of aces left the deck though. There were also "bonus" hands....ace jack of spades, three 777"s, a number of small cards adding up to 21, not sure now how many you needed.

    It was a great game back then.....Damn Thorpe and his book! :)
     
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  15. random_roller, May 6, 2017

    random_roller

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    Luck? It was 100% CI, lol. Yeah, that's the ticket. :D

    For the most part, I use basic strategy when playing BJ, but I've never split 8s against a dealer Ace. That's the only upcard that guarantees the dealer can (if needed/allowed) take a hit and not bust. Sure, it's possible I could have split the 8s and drawn 3-10, 3-10 (now that's CI!). As you can tell, though, I'm not strictly a "by-the-math" type player (BJ, craps, or baccarat). Better lucky than good in a casino works for me.

    Our trip to Machu Picchu and other parts of Peru was wonderful, easily one of the best trips I have ever taken. Hopefully you and others on this forum have been there or will be able to visit there in the future.
     
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  16. HornHiYo, May 6, 2017

    HornHiYo

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    I think that 1/2 % edge pertains to the rare single deck games where players are allowed to double down on any first two cards only, one card on split aces, and the dealer stands on soft 17, no surrender. They are not so rare and easy to find at the counter trap tables and in the high stakes rooms where preferential shuffling is prevalent. Fun plays but short in/out :)

    Back in my shuffle tracking days I could get within a card or two in a six-deck shoe and do the mental gymnastics of TC conversion at a glance. After years of it I found I wanted to enjoy myself a little more so I simplified back to HiLo and then to KO. I found KO is far less intense and it is so easy to play compared to balanced 3&4 counts yet it fares quit well in getting the money.

    BJ, craps, and video poker JoB 9/6 are my favorite games. Actually.... the only casino games I play. I find craps offers the most unqualified and least true advantage of the three games but it comes with opportunities to take down a lot of money quickly and it is more relaxing and enjoyable than BJ.!

    I have your Craps book and I think it is one of the best in describing the game and it includes good, practical advice. :)
     
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  17. HornHiYo, May 6, 2017

    HornHiYo

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    Dang Thorpe is right! He spilled the beans and it killed the game. I suppose if not him it would have been someone else.
    I think the Revere Plus Minus with a side count of aces is about as good a system a player could find back when and remains a very good strategy to this day.
     
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  18. basicstrategy777, May 6, 2017

    basicstrategy777

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    Au contraire......Beat the Dealer was a great thing for the casino's.....everybody thought they could beat the game and played BJ. They, in essence, had no real clue and did not play basicstrategy well......they thought they knew, but most got killed.

    777
     
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  19. von duck, May 6, 2017

    von duck

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    His basic strategy, is the best. Revere that is.
     
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  20. HornHiYo, May 6, 2017

    HornHiYo

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    True, but it wasn't enough for the casinos that the multitudes ran off half cocked playing less than perfect basic strategy. The casinos got paranoid and then greedy and the game killing continues. Actually, the player advantage killing continues, the game is surviving; even the 6:5 blackjack tables fill up.
     
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