The Each Way Win Win Method

Discussion in 'Advanced Craps' started by Blue_Angel, May 24, 2014.

  1. Blue_Angel, May 24, 2014

    Blue_Angel

    Blue_Angel Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2013
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Athens
    Let's get to the point!
    What would I do if I had the option to bet the firebet on EVERY roller and not only when I'm rolling:
    Start a don't pass progression WITHOUT don't odds.
    I'm not sure what's exactly the payouts for 4 or 5 different points,but let's say a 5 pointer pays 250 to 1 and I wager 5 bucks.
    I begin betting a grand martingale progression on don't pass line, like mr MAD PROFESSOR suggests.
    I bet 20 (first point) ,if I lose then 60 (second point),if second point taken,140 on the don't pass line (third point),if 4th point made then 300 (fourth point) and finally if you make it all the way to the 5th point,CONGRATULATIONS because you have won by losing another 620 but you have won 5 x 250 = 1255 (including your initial firebet)
    Let's summarize: 20+60+140+300+620= 1140
    1255 -1140 = 115 bucks risk-free! AND THAT'S THE WAY I LIKE IT BABY!!!
    Of course if a roller loses during anytime before reaching the final level,you'd have anything from: 20(DP) -5(firebet) = 15 up to: 620-(300+140+60+20+5)= 95 bucks net
    Let's summarize:
    First point if lost,profit = 15
    Second point if lost,profit = 35
    Third point if lost,profit = 55
    Fourth point if lost,profit = 75
    Fifth point if lost,profit = 95 / five points made,profit = 115


    Adjustments could be made in order to scale up or down the initial DP and firebet.
    Also interesting some other types of side bets like:

    The "Sharp Shooter" is a side bet in craps spotted at the Hooters casino in Las Vegas in March, 2009.
    The bet is made when a new shooter takes the dice, and pays according to how many times he makes a point (not different points,but just a point)

    POINTS PAYS
    10 or more 299
    9 199
    8 99
    7 49
    6 29
    5 19
    4 9
    3 5
    2 or less -1

    "Replay" is a craps side bet spotted at the Boulder Station on September 16, 2010.
    It pays if the shooter makes the same point at least 3 times before sevening out.

    POINTS PAYS
    4 or 10 four or more times 1000
    5 or 9 four or more times 500
    4 or 10 three times 120
    6 or 8 four or more times 100
    5 or 9 three times 95
    6 or 8 three times 70
    No repeats -1

    Don't you think those 2 additional side bets are good alternatives for "firebet" in order to hedge our grand martingale on Don't Pass Line??!

    LET THE GOOD TIMES ROLL!!!
     
    #1
  2. superrick, May 24, 2014

    superrick

    superrick Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    3,383
    Likes Received:
    1,255
    Well I'm totally lost on this one, to begin with a fire bet is nothing more than a bonus bet if you win it!

    By hedging every point you are just throwing money away if you do win it.

    My question to you is , what do you do when you win your firebet for six points and you have to pay the taxes on that bet? Did you ever think about that anything over 300 to 1 and you have to pay taxes on the win! Now this may seem funny to a lot of you guys, but my wife gets pissed at me every time I win a six point fire bet, because of the taxes! My wife is just like everybody else, she doesn't like to pay taxes, where I have no problem paying them, if your not making money, you are losing, I much rather pay the taxes!

    Hedging a fire bet on ever point makes no sense at all, if you are going to be paying taxes on your win, besides that you are just throwing money away on your hedging!

    When I make 4 points I get paid $125, on 5 points I make $1250, and lets not forget that 6 point fire bet for $5000, now that's if they only allow a $5 firebet. There are some casinos here in Vegas that I will bet $10 on, because they allow it!

    You have the same problem when you make a "Replay" bet and you are paid over 300 to one!
     
    #2
    yacraps likes this.
  3. Blue_Angel, May 25, 2014

    Blue_Angel

    Blue_Angel Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2013
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Athens
    You should consider the whole thing in different way;
    The firebet is the hedge for the main betting method and not the opposite!
    My last feedback said that you have to pay taxes,actually it's withholding from winnings,ONLY for amounts which exceeding 10,000 USD. Did they change this?
    How much do you have to pay in taxes for six point firebet, with 10$ bet?
    If the total is about 6000, they are not making you to sign a tax form at the "cage" and then give you the rest of your earnings.
    Firebet alone is a sucker bet or only for the very good rollers!
    So,in 90% of the cases,should be avoided if there is no serious reason to bet it!
     
    #3
  4. drjohnny, May 25, 2014

    drjohnny

    drjohnny Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2013
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    3
    This system fails miserably if the shooter rolls multiple 7s or 11s during come out and then keeps hitting the same point.

    LOL @ charging $99 for a 19 page e-book.
     
    #4
    crapsdealer likes this.
  5. crapsdealer, May 27, 2014

    crapsdealer

    crapsdealer Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2011
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    2
    Excellent point, keep in mind the fire bet isn't just for hitting multiple points, its for hitting all the different points at least once. Sure it could happen perfectly, but the times I've seen it done (dealing and playing), I think the shooter has always hit the same number a couple of times before finally getting all six of them. And the 7s and 11s on the comeout are sure to kill you
     
    #5
  6. Blue_Angel, May 27, 2014

    Blue_Angel

    Blue_Angel Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2013
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Athens
    Your example is pretty simple, there are six 7s on the come out roll,that's why you need to LAY number 4 or 10 in order to protect the main DP bet.
    Of course after the come out roll,you are taking down the LAY bet,so in your example,I would have 1 point (2 times the same) and two steps down on the grand martingale progression.
    To balance every same point,you are converting from grand martingale to single martingale: -20 , -60 , 100 ...etc
    Let's assume our shooter has three times the same point: -20, -60 , -100 (converted to single martingale), 200 ...and so on.
    The key is to be flexible, "it's a bad plan the one which cannot be altered"
     
    #6
  7. superrick, May 27, 2014

    superrick

    superrick Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    3,383
    Likes Received:
    1,255
    Do you have any idea of how many so called random rollers make the six point fire bet?

    Players make stupid bets all the time, with the fire bet you have the biggest pay out you will ever have on a craps table for one bet! That one win will put you in the black for a long time if you don't go crazy after winning a six point fire bet! Should you bet it on every shooter, hell no, but you can pick out one or two that have been getting some good rolls while you are at the table.

    Every time you are making one of your hedge bets your are just throwing away your money, your pay out will only be a few dollars or worst yet you will break even if you lose your bet and win your hedge.

    Most hedge players are always losing money because they didn't put enough of a hedge up to cover the full amount they are going to lose when the seven comes.

    With any of the prop bets that most players are making that are one roll bets they are still throwing there money away. Now with the stupid fire bet if you do get lucky and win it, it will pay you enough that you may actually come out a winner overall over the course of the year. Now that's if you're like the average player, that only plays craps two to three times a year!

    I tell all of my DI buddies that they should always have a $5 fire bet if they have it on the table, and that they should bet it on anybody that has been getting on any rolls when they are at the table! One come out seven pays for the bet, and if you do get lucky it will definitely make that session for you!

    Craps players make bad bets on the time, when they are making any prop bet. A fire bet with its house edge of 25% is one of the worst prop bets you can make! The only difference is that one pay out on a six point fire bet will make you whole for a long time! Where as a $5 horn high Yo is like pissing your money away for one roll of the dice, even if you win it, and you bet it the next time that little win will never cover what you are going to lose.

    Knowing that the fire bet is a bad bet, and not going crazy with it, like all prop bet players do when they are playing craps, is the key to the fire bet!

    Now with everything that I've said there is one thing that I do that most of you will never do, and that is I only play on empty tables, so there are not to many other players that I will bet the fire bet on! You have to use common sense when playing craps, and some of us don't have any when it comes to gambling! Living in a town where I can walk to a casino to play at any time, does teach you what a bad bet is really fast.

    Look any prop bets are a bad bets, unless those numbers you are betting on are being rolled!
     
    #7
  8. Blue_Angel, May 27, 2014

    Blue_Angel

    Blue_Angel Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2013
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Athens
    Everything is a matter of perspective...
    In my point of view,average rollers with firebets have a "lottery mentality"..."what if I win big?!"
    While the high rollers have quite the opposite mentality,a lot of money with the minimum possible risk!
     
    #8