When do ya pull the plug?

Discussion in 'General Craps Discussion' started by tabletop123, Jul 24, 2017.

  1. Edward-ky, Aug 15, 2017

    Edward-ky

    Edward-ky Member

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    I don't think so. I know a guy that uses a dont betting pattern and he does fairly decent on it
     
    #301
  2. twodicebilly, Aug 15, 2017

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    von duck


    There is no gray area about this at all...zero...

    You cant go up the table and tell the pit boss, ok now I am pretty good at this so I am going to talk to the players so they understand they better not play the donts when I am throwing....please give me a few
    minutes here....

    Number 1...... there Is no way in the world you can tell in advance
    when your going to have a real good roll....none

    Number 2 since that is a fact... and you tell the other players what you plan to do and they bet with you and your shot is horse shit, you
    caused them to lose.....

    So von Duck which is not ethical....not telling them your trying beat
    the table, or telling them your trying to beat the table and you don't..???

    I have to assume your trying to tell us a joke here....

    You go to the able and do the best you can, the other players have to
    decide after watching you throw whether they feel it is better to bet with or against the point.

    tdb
     
    #302
  3. Edward-ky, Aug 15, 2017

    Edward-ky

    Edward-ky Member

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    I believe he took a lesson from James Hall on making a post!
     
    #303
  4. von duck, Aug 15, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    I'm not sure what you think I was saying.
     
    #304
  5. von duck, Aug 15, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    My statement on the matter, wasn't a joke, just an observation. My best guess would be, that ethically speaking, your probably OK, with NOT announcing to the other players, your prowess. Ethical issues are not easy to agree on either, there is never an end to "debate". That is what this and other forums are, a place to carry on the debate. Isn't it great to live in an age where things like this are possible, and in REAL time, amazing! That being said, my beer tab has gotten pretty big, and I need to do something about that, anybody else?
     
    #305
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2017
  6. TDVegas, Aug 15, 2017

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    The reality is that the only "grind play" is happening for the casino, not the player.

    Grinding, a slow stream of small HA, each bet.....whittle, chip, tiny piece here, tiny piece there.

    One can stick with one bet, low house edge...and consider it a "grind play". In reality it's nothing of the sort. The grind is on the other side.

    If someone wants to refer to this type of play as a grind because there is give and take and a very small edge...so be it. The wording isn't reality.

    Grind..to weaken or destroy slowly.
    Yep, sounds about right.
     
    #306
  7. betwthelines, Aug 15, 2017

    betwthelines

    betwthelines Member

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    yes, you are correct: pyramids were not part of the original, legal bank craps tables...the casinos installed them--soon after too--because they were quite aware of the fact that dice influence was not only possible but PROVEN effective.

    from the very beginning blanket type rolls and dice sliding were well KNOWN <sic> to be effective by casino management---yes, true knowledge...thus just as still today, those type rolls as well as hitting the back wall were always and initially outlawed...so among other reasons in order to waste less time enforcing and policing those rules the pyramids were soon installed, which more automatically & routinely insured randomness...it relieved them, obviously not nearly completely but somewhat, from the inherent subjectivity of what is a legal roll

    absolutely it is a legitimate question...and thank you very much for it: in addition to its fine legitimacy, it offered me yet another opportunity to blather on and on and type just to see myself type, one of my gambits for having fun, which is my main goal here...this is not saying my points above are not correct: they are.

    ...just as is the relatively newer result for fun of aggravating the baron with my annoying on and on and on drivel...judging from some of his posts, a thing in which i have also been quite successful.

    lid, not really one of my targets in that anyway, is, i think, more bemused--possibly even amused--than he is annoyed...

    ...could be wrong...but in fairness to myself, incessant goading of, hands down, the top comic on this forum, has not gotten a (subsequent) rise out of him on this logorrhea thing (no offense, twelves, as you are firmly in comedic, second place, albeit a somewhat distant one with others close-by too...no shame whatsoever in that...it is a compliment and not a backhanded one either).

    tom p
    -g. geist: lol...gawd a'mighty, you do go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and. o....
    --tom p:
    ---g. geist: i do not blame the baron one whit for his slumber
    ----tom p: lol
     
    #307
  8. von duck, Aug 15, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    That's pretty good, MR. Hall. I've got a couple pretty good ones too. We never really know what surprises life has in store, do we?
     
    #308
  9. von duck, Aug 15, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    One isn't speaking of absolute definitions, when we say "grind" TD. The house edge is very easy to overcome, it is rather, deviation, which tends to be what kicks a players ASS, not HA. By grind play I'm talking about the fact that you will be planing on playing for an extended time, instead of looking for one good roll, and "Hall" ass. You simply MUST counter, any talk of DON'T play, mustn't you? I find that quite "interesting".
     
    #309
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2017
  10. Settingcanthurt, Aug 15, 2017

    Settingcanthurt

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    I used to think that too till a week ago this sly ol shooter made point 3 times on 10/5/8 in that order against my dont bet. He smiled at me and said had enough yet? I said No you cant keep this up. Doubled my don't pass bet. He tosses a 7.... I say "Unckle' and he just smiles. I pulled the plug.
     
    #310
  11. The Midnight Skulker, Aug 15, 2017

    The Midnight Skulker

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    [Indulge me for bringing up the original topic. :eek:] Have you considered "pulling the plug" when that happens?
    See the thread titled "Is DI a form of cheating?". I strongly suspect there are others, but I am too lazy to search for them.
    The casinos would also get the hard hats and red necks back, the players that just don't know when to pull the plug. (Oh no :eek: I'm doing it again!)
    The dice don't know, but the player does, and as a consequence may be playing with "scared money". Such players are playing not to lose rather than playing to win, which can lead to sub-optimal betting decisions, especially in blackjack where putting additional money at risk (splitting a pair, doubling down) can change your mathematical expectation.
    Hence the term "caught in the grind", meaning the player is losing at close to the expected rate given his/her betting strategy.
    Oh no :eek: It's contagious!
     
    #311
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  12. tabletop123, Aug 16, 2017

    tabletop123

    tabletop123 Member

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    Lol.
     
    #312
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  13. von duck, Aug 16, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    If you look closely, that's exactly what they ARE saying. Some conceal it better than others, the Heffers in the pit, are the worst.
     
    #313
  14. von duck, Aug 16, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    :cool: Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz........................................
     
    #314
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  15. von duck, Aug 16, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    If losing 4 straight, is the end of your rope, you're totally playing the wrong game, I've seen a lot worse than that. I'll look one up in my notes and post it, just to show how bad things really CAN get.
     
    #315
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2017
  16. von duck, Aug 16, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    If you can stand the lack of excitement, I think most players would find it MUCH easier to leave with a winner, if they just played the Don't. It is by NO means, a "LOCK" though.
     
    #316
  17. von duck, Aug 16, 2017

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    :cool: Thank you, Between the Skukerszzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.................
     
    #317
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2017
  18. twodicebilly, Aug 16, 2017

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    midnight skulker

    you said .....The dice don't know, but the player does, and as a consequence may be playing with "scared money". Such players are playing not to lose rather than playing to win, which can lead to sub-optimal betting decisions, especially in blackjack where putting additional money at risk (splitting a pair, doubling down) can change your mathematical expectation.

    I would guess playing with scared money may affect the outcome
    of most DI's more than anything else. Doing this can be for a couple
    of reasons.... you cant afford to lose anymore...so you scared or you
    can still afford to lose, but you just went through a losing streak like we
    all do and you just don't want to lose anymore....the last is by far
    the worst...it is a death sentence for a DI.........you lose confidence
    in the shot.....your afraid to bet enough on the good hands to make
    up for the bad hands .....so you lose and lose and it is much worse
    than a random guy..

    The only player here that seems to do the best has money and he
    bet $10-$25 fire bet.... $25 pass line bet and double odds and $25 5 & 9 and $30 6 & 8........takes a hit and then full press and pull. Here if he
    loses $2500 he goes home, on his trips he gets $10,000-$15,000
    in the hole, he presses first hit, and plays $25 fire bet. I am sure I
    would not want to count the loses by the end of the year, on the other
    hand his number of nightly wins over $10,000 is significant.

    So my sense is that he probably does much better than if he played
    with scared money and quit on a trip when he was $10,000 in the
    hole.

    twodicebilly
     
    #318
  19. betwthelines, Aug 16, 2017

    betwthelines

    betwthelines Member

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    i posted about this soon after it happened which was maybe a couple of years ago now.
    i was at the local joint when 37 straight points went out!! that's right...it occurred to me to start counting about 10 shooters into it when i counted backwards to the last shooter that had made a point, allowing for those who had left and/or came to the rail...memory of it now may be fuzzy but it was no less than 37 and might even have been 38...though not 39 i don't think.

    ...there were a few "passes"--come out 7s and 11s but not all that many of those either...

    talk about a "cold" table!! a bettor laying don't pass line odds would have won 37 straight such bets.

    almost unb'l'bl' but true.

    tom p
     
    #319
  20. Bases loaded, Aug 16, 2017

    Bases loaded

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    Am I being chided by Midnight Skulker for taking the thread 'off topic'?

    Ok. I pull the plug if I lose my session bankroll or am up 100%
     
    #320
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