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$ 4,680 . Anything CAN and DOES happen in a Dice game .(Sam Grafstein the Einstein of dice .)
RECAP OF SUNDAY $110 REPLAY ( BENEFIT OF SENOR $100 , NO WIN )
I decided to play double odds rather than single ($220 take out ) the moves are the same as for $110 .
I bought in for $220 , placing my chips in the front groove on the dice table . The pit kept asking for my name ,
(I never play for comps)so i gave them EL FANFARON so they could leave me alone , go play with their computer.
I was satisfied with the table , none of the players were in CHAIRS, or HOGGING 2 spaces with a sharp elbow in your face.
Another thing i noticed was there was little action found on the XMAS tree (delay of game) which suited me just fine !
The gent (by way of SIAGON) was shooting the dice from a position on my right side . The color of his chips were GREEN -RED-WHITE ,the number he was trying to make was a 9 , he wanted more so he moved in more soldiers to do battle with the HOUSE , $5 on the field (Machine gun action) $12 on the 6 & 8 each plus some white chip action on the XMAS tree. Siagon’s flat wager was $10 plus double odds , but he had a white STUFFED under his pass line flat and odds , including 2 whites to the left side of said flat/odds ??
Would someone please tell me WHAT the whites were doing !!??
Siagon got a 10 rolled for a win on the field, on the next roll he got a 7 , which he promptly c——ed.
My turn to roll , but i passed the dice , which gave the dice to a man who had shooved his way between myself and the gent with RINGS on all his RING fingers . I dont bet a shooter (most of the time) until they get a hit (throw a natural or make their point) . I passed the dice to Shove.
Shove’s take out was $300 , his flat bet was $5 plus double odds , on his first roll he threw the eleven , so i get to make my first wager,
$5 on the pass line , lo and behold ANOTHER natural by Senor Shove . I promptly PARLAYED adding one red chip to the PARLAY .
($15). NOTE> Parlaying of Naturals on comeout for a point is a SMART bet , (3 for 1 and the Odds earmarked for the bet goes back
goes back into the first groove)
I like to add a chip to this PARLAY .
As i have witnessed so many many times over the past 66 years -shooter THROWS ANOTHER NATURAL !!
$30 for $10 and i have not touched the odds !! (r $20 for $5)This is NOT a pretend game , i actually played this game myself.
I Now i increase my pass line bet to $7 (50%approx) and hold $10 for odds should a number be rolled . This leaves me holding
$13 untill the roll is complete ,simply put-Upon winning a bet and completing the increase for the next number that shows,+ ODDS you put whatever REMAINS in to the 2nd groove on the dice table. Once you have played out all you chips in the first groove , you count the chips that are in the 2nd groove ($4,680) , if enough , you then move UP to the next level of play $7 .
Levels of play are as follows $7-14-14-15 etc up to table limit ONE LEVEL AT THE TIME ! 7-10-15-25-35 ETC- In this way your letting the House chase your PEANUT with their big plam trees or ENTIRE CASINO BANKROLL !
YOU ARE NUTS -ENTIRE CASINO BANKROLL!!
SPAM MAN !! GET OUT !
Before i go would you please tell me this—————————————-DOES THE HOUSE BOOK ALL BETS ?
I wonder if Mr. Shank would care to answer that question for all of us.
(stick around $100)
The gent (by way of SIAGON) was shooting the dice from a position on my right side . The color of his chips were GREEN -RED-WHITE ,the number he was trying to make was a 9 , he wanted more so he moved in more soldiers to do battle with the HOUSE , $5 on the field (Machine gun action) $12 on the 6 & 8 each plus some white chip action on the XMAS tree. Siagon’s flat wager was $10 plus double odds , but he had a white STUFFED under his pass line flat and odds , including 2 whites to the left side of said flat/odds ??
Would someone please tell me WHAT the whites were doing !!??
Odds bet for the dealers? $2 to pay $3 Maybe that’s “Saigon”, huh?
dados - 23 March 2010 02:08 AM
My turn to roll , but i passed the dice , which gave the dice to a man who had shooved his way between myself and the gent with RINGS on all his RING fingers . I dont bet a shooter (most of the time) until they get a hit (throw a natural or make their point) . I passed the dice to Shove.
Shove’s take out was $300 , his flat bet was $5 plus double odds , on his first roll he threw the eleven , so i get to make my first wager,
$5 on the pass line , lo and behold ANOTHER natural by Senor Shove . I promptly PARLAYED adding one red chip to the PARLAY .
($15). NOTE> Parlaying of Naturals on comeout for a point is a SMART bet , (3 for 1 and the Odds earmarked for the bet goes back
goes back into the first groove)
I like to add a chip to this PARLAY .
As i have witnessed so many many times over the past 66 years -shooter THROWS ANOTHER NATURAL !!
$30 for $10 and i have not touched the odds !! (r $20 for $5)This is NOT a pretend game , i actually played this game myself.
Well, if you’re 90 and have played craps for ??? years, I’m sure you have witnessed that many, many times, as well as the many more times that it doesn’t happen. Are you saying that naturals are more likely to come in pairs, or streaks?
So, you bet $5, win on a natural, parlay and add another $5. Now if you lose, you’re down $10, net, which is slightly more likely than winning the bet. Even though you’ve won 50% of your bets (all two of them), you’re down $10. In my view, this does not make sense for a player with a short bankroll. It definitely increases the chances of his busting. Of course, if he wins it, it gives his bankroll a nice boost. What I’m saying is that a progressive system must always increase the probability of busting a small bankroll.
dados - 23 March 2010 02:08 AM
I Now i increase my pass line bet to $7 (50%approx) and hold $10 for odds should a number be rolled . This leaves me holding
$13 untill the roll is complete ,simply put-Upon winning a bet and completing the increase for the next number that shows,+ ODDS you put whatever REMAINS in to the 2nd groove on the dice table. Once you have played out all you chips in the first groove , you count the chips that are in the 2nd groove ($4,680) , if enough , you then move UP to the next level of play $7 .
Levels of play are as follows $7-14-14-15 etc up to table limit ONE LEVEL AT THE TIME ! 7-10-15-25-35 ETC- In this way your letting the House chase your PEANUT with their big plam trees or ENTIRE CASINO BANKROLL !
YOU ARE NUTS -ENTIRE CASINO BANKROLL!!
SPAM MAN !! GET OUT !
Huh?
dados - 23 March 2010 02:08 AM
Before i go would you please tell me this—————————————-DOES THE HOUSE BOOK ALL BETS ?
I wonder if Mr. Shank would care to answer that question for all of us.
(stick around $100)
Dados -correr el gallo
Not sure what you’re asking here.
Does the house (not anyone/anything else) book all bets?
Does the house book ALL bets, i.e. anything anyone proposes?
Obviously, there are table maximums, but a casino manager might decide to book bets in excess. There was some story about Binion’s booking some monster bets, years ago. Again, I’m not sure what you’re getting at here.
Cheers,
Alan Shank
OK folks I made another casino visit and another losing session.I did not keep track of my plays as well as I had intended not nearly as detailed as DADOS what a memory for your age . I did wait till a pass line point was established then placed another number the 6 or 8 mostly but the 5 or nine a couple of times made a few hits but the 7s were coming faster than could be out run. On my roll I would go back to my strategy of craps check on the come out as I have had good luck with this on my roll before was not to be this day though. The best I ever done on my roll was hit 1 point per roll then 7 out ,, by the way $5 point and single odds was my bet on all my rolls. Played maybe 45 min. lost $30 went and played poker won back that and more try the craps again drop about 30 more go home. I was talkin to a shooter there that said the table was like that the entire day even a guy that was betting the don’t single odds was losing because of a run o7s on different come out rollls. So what can I say try again I surely will.
P.S Sorry for my poor writing skills
There was a guy at the table when I walked up the 1st time betting mainly the field on his roll a flat bet only on the pass line no odds and kept up his field. He seemed to be having a bit of luck varying his field up and down from 5 to 20 not sure what his method was. I was told later that he started with 100 ran it up to near 300 and left with the original 100 he may very well have done better than anyone at the table even though I know he was making probably one of the worst bets to be made. I see where craps is a game of much self control where your bankroll is concerned it is so easy to keep playing on a losing day or in a losing way. Really need to think maybe I shoud call it quits for today or change up the strategy a bit. Just my thoughts probably not rite but just thinking.
Thanks for reading my crappy report of another crappy day
Thanks for the suggestions and response—-all of you .(Dados)
Stick around fellows , with your help i am starting to belive we can at last make $100 a winner at craps.
66 ? might be 70 years if you throw in 4 years rolling dice at a CB Shack and the USS Neeches overseas .
Might have won more back then if i had realized PARYING naturals on come out roll for a point was the smartest wager on CRAP table . (Unless someone can show me a better number to parlay on comeout roll for a point ) .
HOUSE Books all bets .——You start with a PEANUT bet ,(The House will book this bet!) after two wins are completed you are a NET winner. Thereafter increase winning bets 50%(The House will book your bets) untill you reach TABLE LIMIT, (Still the house will book your bets) THEN PLAY TABLE LIMIT.(Yes the house will STILL book your (all ) bets!!! Even a bet that started out as a PEANUT wager)
On the way to the Casino , see ya all tomorrow when i will give you RINGS ON ALL HIS RING FINGERS big roll.
There was a guy at the table when I walked up the 1st time betting mainly the field on his roll a flat bet only on the pass line no odds and kept up his field. He seemed to be having a bit of luck varying his field up and down from 5 to 20 not sure what his method was. I was told later that he started with 100 ran it up to near 300 and left with the original 100 he may very well have done better than anyone at the table even though I know he was making probably one of the worst bets to be made. I see where craps is a game of much self control where your bankroll is concerned it is so easy to keep playing on a losing day or in a losing way. Really need to think maybe I shoud call it quits for today or change up the strategy a bit. Just my thoughts probably not rite but just thinking.
Thanks for reading my crappy report of another crappy day
Just because you are losing, that doesn’t mean you will continue to lose. The dice have no memory and hot/cold tables exist only in the past, i.e. there is no such thing as a table that favors the right side or “wrong” side. No matter how you are playing and what success you have had since you began the session, NOTHING can be concluded about the next bet or the next series of bets. This is called random variation. Hence, there is no particular reason to switch to a different bet/strategy, nor any particular reason NOT to switch, either. Remember that the dice do not feel obligated to show you a nice, pyramid-shaped distribution in the short term, i.e. just because there hasn’t been a seven for a while doesn’t make the seven more likely. That is the Gambler’s Fallacy.
Also, just because you see someone having success with some strategy or type of bet, do not conclude that is a “good” way to play. A player can get lucky and win betting the Big 6/8 or the Any 7. The Field bet is not a bad bet if they pay triple on the 2 or 12. For example, it has a lower house edge and less volatility per bet than placing the 5/9. The main danger with the Field is that it is a one-roll bet, so you can go through money pretty quickly. If you make it only on comeout rolls you slow it down.
One thing is for sure: the surest was to not bust $100 (other than not playing at all or having a stop loss) is to bet minimum pass line and take no odds; you have about a 99% chance to last two hours or 60 bets. OTOH, it’s pretty boring and you’re not going to win much if you’re lucky, because volatility works both ways.
You started this thread complaining about busting a $100 bankroll repeatedly, so my posts have concentrated on how to avoid busting. Dados is showing you an aggressive method that certainly will produce big wins, but rarely, because you cannot withstand a losing streak and you throw away winnings when you parlay and progress your bets, unless you get a streak. Those methods kill you on a choppy table (WLWLWLWL).
You pays your money and you takes your choice!
Cheers,
Alan Shank
Thanks for all the advice and you are 100% rite what you suggested did make my stay at the table alot longer and had I stuck it out till the end things may have turned around I will be back.
There was some story about Binion’s booking some monster bets, years ago.
By all accounts Benny Binion had a standing offer at the LV Horseshoe that he would let any player establish his/her own table limit with his/her first bet. IOW a whale could bet, for example, $1,000,000 at the beginning of a session and Benny would book it and make the table limit $1,000,000 for that player. I did not hear of anyone actually doing that, nor do I know what the biggest bet Benny booked (and say that three times quickly) was.
A young Texan by the name of WILLIAM LEE BERGSTROM made his first bet which was $777,000(which he won) , the second bet was $538,000 (which he also won) his thrid and final bet was for $1,000,000(wich he lost) He bet the million on the DONT PASS AND THE SHOOTER ROLLED A NATURAL A 6 AN A 1 . BERGSTROM commited suicide in his Hotel Room at the MARINA HOTEL on the Las Vegas STRIP . He was still up on BINNIONS ($315,000) , a spat caused his death “GUARDIA YO PARA TE -AMOR ”
As POSTED , i went to the Dice Table again late afternoon yesterday . Used the same play as the one played Sunday ($4,680)
a play i call the ADOPTED COME play. Cashed out $244 , my take out $220 . I was hungry so my WIN LOSS decision was go get your steak . (Won barely enough to do that).
Table was OK————shooters were all STAND UP PLAYERS , none were in HIGH CHAIRS-AND/OR ELBOWS ON THE TABLE WITH THEIR ASS HUNG OUT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE FLOOR . The player on my left was a BACKSIDE PLAYER , which got my attention since i am mainly a WRONG bettor . He was coaching a NEWBIE who’s hairdo looked just like our FIRST LADY . In my opinion HE needed the coaching , i liked the way he layed odds and that he made a DONT PASS wager plus two dont come wagers (If the dice would let him). What i didnt like was “NO ACTION” ! Every time a 6 or 8 showed he waved the dealer off “NO ACTION” .
NOTE :
I have said this in another THREAD but it bears repeating for the last time . Aside from giving up (giving back to the house) a 100%
sneaky winning bet - if a player -YOU- continue to Avoid (No Action) the dont pass 6 or 8 and/or pick it up ,then the HOUSE, yes the HOUSE -WILL- within a short time frame (especially careerwise) CUT YOU—A BRAND NEW ASSHOLE . (Dados 1993)
When the FIRST LADY’S HAIRDO TWIN’S Dice turn came she bet $5 on the Pass line , she was also THRILLED with all the numbers she saw on the Field , then helpfully led to the slaughter by her DONT PASS COACH .
2.7 is a tough edge to over come on a one shot roll , so as i have instructed you in another thread you would need to use progressive WIN increases (50%) to Overcome said edge, AND More INPORTANT—TO GIVE YOUR MONEY A FAIR GAMBLE YOU MUST TAKE OUR 50 CHIPS OF ANY AMOUNT , otherwise (careerwise) you will wind up of all men most miserable .
NICE HAIRDO did not make her point (5) , and failed on the field . I lost nothing since i do NOT bet until a shooter gets a hit .(throws a natural or makes a point)
On her left was a nice looking lady (with sweetheart lips) who enjoyed “shaking the dice” before she released them into the wild blue yonder . Her First ” yonder” resulted in a craps as did her second wild blue . Unseccessful with her established point (10) the Dice then moved to a Gent (next to the stick man) with RINGS on ALL his RING fingers .
This time we got some action. RINGS first roll was a natural , i now placed $5 on the pass line , RINGS pleased me by throwing ANOTHER NATURAL (11) i added one chip($15) RINGS PLEASE ME AGAIN BY “BUCKING” THE 11 .
Note: I have , in other threads called this wager THE smartest WAGER TO MAKE ON A CRAP TABLE (ParlaY all naturals on comeout roll -no need to add one chip ) If is SMART because no other SHOT offers less edge (other than my sneaky wager), futhermore you salvage the odds and stil have a 3 to 1 bet going . Win one PARLAY out of three and you make money . Would you like to know what the batting average is on that particular PARLAY ? Solid Information , or mathematics .
DOUBLE NOTE; Dice dealers look mostly at odds your twirl , or they might call you a Profesional if you won a big hand a couple of times, what they fail to observe is that a DICE NUMBER REPEATS ITSELT many times , always has acted this way , One thing they do agree on is THE COMEOUT ROLL FOR A POINT GETS MOST NATURALS THAN ANY OTHER ROLL ON A DICE TABLE .
Example: TRY(10 SHOOTER TAKE OUT $310) $31 NO 6 OR 8—COME OUT ROLL ONLY !
TheN try by letting the 6 ride. Information Friend . GUARDIA YO PARA TE -AMOR DAD0S
ANOTHER NOTE: Nice Hairdo turned out to be( 3rd try) the one who made this Session a WINNING one, -provided you Increased your winning bets (50%) on her sweet rolls, otherwise you could just stare at me while i cashed in- A WINNER .NOTHING WRONG WITH$24
Even the Dont Pass coach then reached in his pocket for money ,cursed (not under his breath)
HIS PROBLEM-? NO ACTION & CHASING A DONT PASS SHOOTER-
I HAVE TOLD YOU BEFORE WITH DONT PASS -DO NOT—DO NOT CHASE A SHOOTER , IF YOU WIN -YOU HAVE WON ON A BAD BET
THEN 83 MORE BAD BETS HAVE YOUR ADDRESS AND THEY SHOW UP ON YOUR DICE DOORSTEP THE VERY NEXT DAY!
DADOS
Getting Hungry again see you later beore you hit the Dice BRICK WALL.
100 STICK AROUND . PLEASE .
This time we got some action. RINGS first roll was a natural , i now placed $5 on the pass line , RINGS pleased me by throwing ANOTHER NATURAL (11) i added one chip($15) RINGS PLEASE ME AGAIN BY “BUCKING” THE 11 .
Note: I have , in other threads called this wager THE smartest WAGER TO MAKE ON A CRAP TABLE (ParlaY all naturals on comeout roll -no need to add one chip ) If is SMART because no other SHOT offers less edge (other than my sneaky wager), futhermore you salvage the odds and stil have a 3 to 1 bet going . Win one PARLAY out of three and you make money . Would you like to know what the batting average is on that particular PARLAY ? Solid Information , or mathematics .
Actually, parlaying simply subjects twice as much money to the edge that applies to ALL passline and come bets, -.01414. That “batting average” is going to be .493, very good for baseball, but… It’s not a 3 to 1 bet at all, because it’s just a passline bet, no more likely to be resolved on the comeout than any other passline bet.
As to “win one parlay out of three and you make money”, well, you’ve already won the first bet, so you might as well say, “Stop betting and you make money every time”. In fact, the probability that you’ll lose the $5 you already won is .5071.
dados - 24 March 2010 11:52 AM
DOUBLE NOTE; Dice dealers look mostly at odds your twirl , or they might call you a Profesional if you won a big hand a couple of times, what they fail to observe is that a DICE NUMBER REPEATS ITSELT many times , always has acted this way , One thing they do agree on is THE COMEOUT ROLL FOR A POINT GETS MOST NATURALS THAN ANY OTHER ROLL ON A DICE TABLE .
Example: TRY(10 SHOOTER TAKE OUT $310) $31 NO 6 OR 8—COME OUT ROLL ONLY !
TheN try by letting the 6 ride. Information Friend .
This, of course, is superstitious nonsense, and I’ll bet very, very few dealers believe that, if any.
Cheers,
Alan Shank
A young Texan by the name of WILLIAM LEE BERGSTROM made his first bet which was $777,000(which he won) , the second bet was $538,000 (which he also won) his thrid and final bet was for $1,000,000(wich he lost)
Thanks for the name. I did a Google search on it and came up with several links. All agree that his first bet was $777k, and that he walked into Binion’s with two suitcases, one with his money and one for his winnings, which earned him the moniker The Suitcase Man. The sequence of events that followed, and when they occurred, varies among the accounts, but all the stories end with him losing the $1M bet and comitting suicide in some fashion despite being ahead overall.
The first set of Dice i ever saw were white (On board the USS Neeches WW11 era 1941) they rest now at the bottom of the Pacific Ocean . Unless the Captain was hiding money, there was only $58 total on the ship , a player (from Galveston ,Texas ) won ALL the money after going broke($58) then borrowing $5 to get back in the game .
When i got to Vegas i was already a Experienced Dice Player (Or thought i was ), i soon found out (after looking at my bankroll) i was missing a few Winning plays . One of these winning plays goes like this : I found dozen upon dozen of Dice books that give all the correct House edge on any bet , none of which will make me or ANYONE a winning Dice Player . It Takes a LOT MORE , MUCH MUCH MORE ,——————one such MORE is to play for the LARGE or the Small Profit hand which enables a player to use a MONEY MANAGEMENT METHOD of play , which starts by giving your gambling money a fair gamble . I sell a few books (since 1993 ) preaching this message, i could sell MORE changing the cover to read————————————————————————————-
DICE SECRET !! HOW I LEARNED TO MAKE A MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR FROM A DICE TABLE.
About high rollers , JIMMY CHAGRA was a well know HIGH ROLLER, HE BEAT Binion Horseshoe AND THE RIVIERA for over a MILLION DOLLARS , he also won a single bet of 100,000 at one of Binions BLACKJACK TABLES . In those days i got these stories form Dealers i knew at the GOLDEN NUGGET and Binions who all agree the 7 on comeout roll for a point parlay (3 to 1 -3 for 1 as you like it) is the smartest bet on a crap table .
ABOUT BIG WINS .
A very large win occured ($800.000 before the 7 came along) at the TREASURE CHEST CASINO 10 years ago , during the shoot the HOUSE CHANGED DEALERS 10 TIMES TRYING TO GET A SEVEN OUT !
CHAGRA , THE GREEK, (GREEK WON ALL THE $5,000 CHIPS BINNIONS HAD, THEY CALLED HIM UP TO GET A FEW BACK) BERGSTROM, GOLDMAN , - Small fry to RUSSIAN LOUIE and his CHUM ( Native American by way Mexico ) By the way- I found out what happed to said CHUM (the last spot was 1955 with two siblings both Hombres )-
To curb crime in Mexico , habitual Criminals are PARACHUTED out over Vietnam where they die( so that their soul might be saved on that great day) they die in vietnam for lack latin song and baile tipico(Latin Dance). Flight 444 leaves Mexico City 8 AM 5 days a week . In command of the flight is Captain JOSE ARRIGA who was born in Ojos Negros , Mexico . Once on the flight tarp Captain Arriga pulls back HARD on the ‘tiller” , Engines SCREAM , like a desperate MATING CALL of a Baja Caalifornia female coyote . Flight 444 climbs into the sky very swiftly like a ISRAELI JET FIGHTER , once flight altitude is attained Captain Arriga switches on Mexican Song - a lovely voice ring out “guardia YO para te- AMOR ” tears then flow like wine -r—-running down the planes aisle -within said tears is (quess what) a set of DICE Louie Chum got rid of by mistake(Siagon likes slick Dice games-if they dont catch you)
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