A couple of miles up the road from me we have a gentlemen with this handle. Doesn’t post here so I’m going to present his strategy divided by 5. ($5 table instead of $25) This strategy espouses the come bet. As we have learned on this site despite the howls of protest by place betters, this is mathematically the smartest way to play. And now without further adieus:

Assume a 20X table, $5 minimum. $5 pass line bet. Upon a number rolling no odds before second number. Make continuous come bets. After first come travels place 5X odds on all bets. Each hit you press the odds bet of the hit number in the following fashion: 5X to 6X to 8X to 11X to 15X to 20X. After that you would have to increase your flat bet to keep the exponential increase in odds. Of course at a 10X table your max bet is 10X and then you increase your flat. A 7 on the come out, you start from scratch. There is more, of course, about qualifying shooters to actually play this way. And we don’t do no stinkin hedges like craps checks. It goes without saying that you need at least a 10X table or else you would lose that mathematical edge over the place betters.

No I haven’t tried this yet, my next trip will definitely do it, since my last 7 in a row PSO cured me of $X inside after a point!!

DeMango - 07 February 2012 07:38 AM

A couple of miles up the road from me we have a gentlemen with this handle. Doesn’t post here so I’m going to present his strategy divided by 5. ($5 table instead of $25)

  This strategy espouses the come bet. As we have learned on this site despite the howls of protest by place betters, this is mathematically the smartest way to play. And now without further adieus:

Assume a 20X table, $5 minimum. $5 pass line bet. Upon a number rolling no odds before second number. Make continuous come bets. After first come travels place 5X odds on all bets. Each hit you press the odds bet of the hit number in the following fashion: 5X to 6X to 8X to 11X to 15X to 20X. After that you would have to increase your flat bet to keep the exponential increase in odds. Of course at a 10X table your max bet is 10X and then you increase your flat. A 7 on the come out, you start from scratch. There is more, of course, about qualifying shooters to actually play this way. And we don’t do no stinkin hedges like craps checks. It goes without saying that you need at least a 10X table or else you would lose that mathematical edge over the place betters.

No I haven’t tried this yet, my next trip will definitely do it, since my last 7 in a row PSO cured me of $X inside after a point!!

DeMango -

You, Sir, are taking liberties - that are not acknowledged / granted - only assumptions on your part -

You are making unwarranted proclamations - which are not only - totally false -

Almost as false as BullShitter 777’s claim to ” knowing how to set a certain dice set - which his does routinely - but can recall as to how he does it - till he checks with his Guru ” -

As the ” howling place bettor protestor ” - as you so succintly define the adversaries -

I am still waiting the ” challange ” that was presented to YOU, Sh*tBrown 777 - and the rest of you ” Mathemetical Wizards ” -

Of course that will never materialize -

Neither will BullShitter777’s response to his ” chicken noodle set ” that he does routinely - but does not remember how to do it -

  What happens to your ” best bet in the house ” theory when you face less than 10X odds -

Do you just not play - take your little rubber ball and go home -

777 is full of shit - he’s a wanna be - a liar -

I have more respect for you -

I am still awaiting the ” face-off ” between place and come bets -

As of yet - there is no ” Come Bettor ” who ” Has a Pair ” -

Balls - that is - not dice !!!!!!!!!!!

My Dear SnakeEyes;
It was with you in mind as I penned the words “howls of protest”. I expected your response and you did not disappoint me. Almost as if I were to use the word ma**et!! I have enough respect for the integrity of those who say the programs have been written and the math checked. I am speaking of Guido, Allan Shank and others. I’m not going to reinvent the wheel, and I realize that you probably need a 10X table to even get the full benefits of what the Captain calls his “exponential betting”

For me my “Come to Jesus moment” came recently, the results of 7, they were counted by the box, 7 PSO’s. Set a point, go $44-$90 inside and wham bam, thank you mam. A very expensive lesson. So what we have here is an antidote to that expensive lesson, and a mathematical sound one at that. No more no less. You can even find Heavy acknowledging it at his site although he likes to place the 6 & 8 and then institute continuous come bets.

So as far as the challenge goes, I don’t really care to one up anyone, I’m here for the best way of getting the money, (not win an argument) are not we all? I personally always thought that “Three point Molly” was the way to go, but as I noticed on long rolls, those practitioners were always having to reload and thought that was wasting bets. In closing, my friend, I know I can count on you!

DeMango - 07 February 2012 10:14 PM

My Dear SnakeEyes;
It was with you in mind as I penned the words “howls of protest”. I expected your response and you did not disappoint me. Almost as if I were to use the word ma**et!! I have enough respect for the integrity of those who say the programs have been written and the math checked. I am speaking of Guido, Allan Shank and others. I’m not going to reinvent the wheel, and I realize that you probably need a 10X table to even get the full benefits of what the Captain calls his “exponential betting”

For me my “Come to Jesus moment” came recently, the results of 7, they were counted by the box, 7 PSO’s. Set a point, go $44-$90 inside and wham bam, thank you mam. A very expensive lesson. So what we have here is an antidote to that expensive lesson, and a mathematical sound one at that. No more no less. You can even find Heavy acknowledging it at his site although he likes to place the 6 & 8 and then institute continuous come bets.

So as far as the challenge goes, I don’t really care to one up anyone, I’m here for the best way of getting the money, (not win an argument) are not we all? I personally always thought that “Three point Molly” was the way to go, but as I noticed on long rolls, those practitioners were always having to reload and thought that was wasting bets. In closing, my friend, I know I can count on you!

DeMango -

You had a very disconcerting losing - back to back to back .... episode -

Seriously, I am sorry for you -

More seriously, I am more sorry for you that because of your loss(s)  that you have despaired -

Apparently, given up hope -

Said in essence ” F*ck It ” - It don’t work !

At the last PT event in AC at SB - Linda and I won $750 combined at the table -

Went to GN - afterwards - hooked up at a table with a couple of other DI’s -

Totally by happenstance / luck - same place - same time -

Took $1K from the GN in about 1-2 hours -

That is a story in and of itself - which I will not go into detail about - here and now -

Totally - unf*ckingbelieavable - as to how and why things worked out the way that they did -

Then proceeded to give back $2.3K the following two days -

FWIW - Linda always waits for the results of her 1st throw after establishing a point to see how her tossing goes -

Taking it a step further -

We set the 4/3 - 5/2 ALL 7’s for the C/O -

Hardeight - hardsix -

What have you got ?

Double Pitch -

Change sets - double pitch - what do you have - 7- OUT !

Your C/O roll should be a learning curve as respects what your next throw should be indicative of -

At least, that’s how I look at things -

And, Alas, mi amigo - come bets are the worst of the 2 wagers !!!!!!!!!!!

I am considering adding “the 36 count” to my repertoire. That is counting the FF’s of my first 36 rolls so that any PFH’s or DP’s can manifest themselves and my point cycle set can be adjusted if needed. If that works I can write a book like Scoblete!

DeMango - 07 February 2012 10:52 PM

I am considering adding “the 36 count” to my repertoire. That is counting the FF’s of my first 36 rolls so that any PFH’s or DP’s can manifest themselves and my point cycle set can be adjusted if needed. If that works I can write a book like Scoblete!

See if Hardeight still has his ” Monopoly System Strategy ” for sale -

I do believe its time for a change of pace - OR reconsideration !

Demango -

Better yet -

Make your way up to AC for President’s Day weekend -

There will be a few of us there -

Nothing is promised -

Should be interesting - to say the least !

$nakeEye$ - 07 February 2012 11:04 PM

Demango -

Better yet -

Make your way up to AC for President’s Day weekend -

There will be a few of us there -

Nothing is promised -

Should be interesting - to say the least !

Snakeeyes, with all that money you’re hauling out of those tubs, maybe you should take the show on the road and take a vacation down south.  Tunica is supposedly a craps mecca, although honestly I do like Biloxi better.  Then again, the horseshoe in Bossier City has 100x odds along with the firebet as well.
Come on down.

Southern-Comfort - 08 February 2012 12:05 AM

$nakeEye$ - 07 February 2012 11:04 PM

Demango -

Better yet -

Make your way up to AC for President’s Day weekend -

There will be a few of us there -

Nothing is promised -

Should be interesting - to say the least !

Snakeeyes, with all that money you’re hauling out of those tubs, maybe you should take the show on the road and take a vacation down south.  Tunica is supposedly a craps mecca, although honestly I do like Biloxi better.  Then again, the horseshoe in Bossier City has 100x odds along with the firebet as well.
Come on down.

When we are ready to make the trip South -

Linda and I will most definately take you up on your ” Southern Hospitality -

However, in the interum - we must relegate our play to A/C, NJ OR Sands/Mt.Airy in PA -

S-C -

For sure - ” Some Day ” - however - regretably - not ” Today ” -

Thanks for the invite !

I havent posted to this sight in quite some time.  Mostly because the debates got ridiculous.  I am an avid place better.  I bypass the come out and place 44 or 66 inside usually.  Depending on my bankroll.  Take the first three hits and press from there.  Usually pressing 50 percent.  If i have the dice i hedge crap.  If im making money or they are throwing them, ill jump on the 4 and 10.  Lately, i have seen more point sevens or one number two number seven out type of rolls than ever.  Im getting quite frustrated.  I’m open to a new method.  I feel like im missing something, or there has to be a better way.  All of the math i’ve done, i feel like this was the best.  With the amount of losses i;ve had lately, im starting to question it.  Any suggestions would be appreciated.  If anyone wants more details on how i play i;d have no problem breaking it down detailed.  Thank you

lucky4688 - 09 February 2012 04:59 PM

I havent posted to this sight in quite some time.  Mostly because the debates got ridiculous.  I am an avid place better.  I bypass the come out and place 44 or 66 inside usually.  Depending on my bankroll.  Take the first three hits and press from there.  Usually pressing 50 percent.  If i have the dice i hedge crap.  If im making money or they are throwing them, ill jump on the 4 and 10.  Lately, i have seen more point sevens or one number two number seven out type of rolls than ever.  Im getting quite frustrated.  I’m open to a new method.  I feel like im missing something, or there has to be a better way.  All of the math i’ve done, i feel like this was the best.  With the amount of losses i;ve had lately, im starting to question it.  Any suggestions would be appreciated.  If anyone wants more details on how i play i;d have no problem breaking it down detailed.  Thank you

lucky4688 -

Simple solution -

If the dice are NOT passing - WHY are you betting the PassLine -

Should you not be ” betting with the dice and NOT against the dice ” -

” Take what the table is giving you ” -

If its giving 6’s and 8’s - go with them - etc…..... -

If its giving you PSO’s - bet the darkside -

You, presumably are there for the same resaon as I -

To WIN -

If it rubs people the wrong way that you are winning while they are losing -

  F*ck Them ! -”

There,  I’ve Said It Again ! “

Perhaps someday Johnny Mathis just might use that lyric in a award winning song or two !

However, in the meantime - go with the flow !

Snakeeyes;
    Sir, you are making too much sense and way too simple. Maybe we can get the falcon to weigh in on this!

DeMango - 07 February 2012 07:38 AM

A couple of miles up the road from me we have a gentlemen with this handle. Doesn’t post here so I’m going to present his strategy divided by 5. ($5 table instead of $25) This strategy espouses the come bet. As we have learned on this site despite the howls of protest by place betters, this is mathematically the smartest way to play. And now without further adieus:

Assume a 20X table, $5 minimum. $5 pass line bet. Upon a number rolling no odds before second number. Make continuous come bets. After first come travels place 5X odds on all bets. Each hit you press the odds bet of the hit number in the following fashion: 5X to 6X to 8X to 11X to 15X to 20X. After that you would have to increase your flat bet to keep the exponential increase in odds. Of course at a 10X table your max bet is 10X and then you increase your flat. A 7 on the come out, you start from scratch. There is more, of course, about qualifying shooters to actually play this way. And we don’t do no stinkin hedges like craps checks. It goes without saying that you need at least a 10X table or else you would lose that mathematical edge over the place betters.

No I haven’t tried this yet, my next trip will definitely do it, since my last 7 in a row PSO cured me of $X inside after a point!!

DeMango,

I have run this simulation through Wincraps and have had mixed results.  When the results are positive, you can really expand your winnings.  But you can also dump a bunch of cash in short order.  You have to have the bankroll to handle those initial come bet multiples. If you bet minimums, this is probably not for you.

What I found was that the initial come bets do protect you on the initial rolls to the PSO.  If you wait until two come bets are up before adding odds, you protect a little more.  This is a betting strategy based on the original Ponzer strategy which is to keep two come bets active.

This works best with a 10 or better roll by the shooter with lots of box numbers. Once you hit a number, you press the odds by the correct units and rack the rest. The first winner covers that come bet and odds. Then each winner after that is adding money to the chip rack as well as pressing bets. 

Many place bet strategies have money at risk for multiple hands before there is a profit potential on that bet. With this strategy you could also have your money at risk for multiple rolls, but on each repeater, you are moving money to the rails. This works best when the shooter has a small set of repeating box numbers.  If the shooter hits all of the open box numbers before the repeater, you will have a bunch of money at risk to the seven-out.

With random rolls, my Wincraps simulations have been negative.  Adjusting for a DI with an SRR around 7, I have seen some very positive results.

I’m hoping this works good for my toss because I shoot a lot of results where the outside numbers appear. I’m looking forward to trying it at the next time I get to the tables, as well.

Thanks Bro;
Indeed the Captain does have an influenced throw and has a ton of variance. I believe his testimony of being ahead for several years has more to do with his influence rather than his choice of come vs place. But no doubt this strategy eliminates early PSO’s as a money loser. I, also will give this a long look at my next foray.

lucky4688,
I’m using a “follow the trend” method with moderate success,
If the table trend favors point numbers being made, I’ll wait for a point to be established, then bet $44 inside($5 table). 1 hit and I regress my bets, then up and pull 1 unit at a time. If I lose my initial bet of $44 to a PSO, I’ll switch over to JP’s “ricochet”. After the next point is established, I lay the point, same time add a $15 DC(lay acts as a PSO hedge for the DC). When the DC travels to a number, take the lay down and add another $15 DC. You can also hedge the DC bets against the 11 with a $1 yo. Replace only twice if the DC’s get taken. Try and be up on 2 DC bets.  If you make money on the “don’t”, stick with it. If you lose money, switch back to “do” betting. As JP says, this keeps you “in tune” with a cold table, but also gets you on a possible hot roll.

One other point.
If the table trend is favoring PSO, I’ll start with the “ricochet” then switch to inside betting if I don’t make money on the shooter.
Tom

All these systems and opinions…....and not one strategy on when to lock in a profit on a shooter.  Just press, 5x odds, press,  press, etc. 
  Geez…......if a shooter rolls 3 or more numbers, seven outs and you dont show a profit….......you are either playing the wrong game or need to rethink your gambling strategy.  Some of these systems shown here,  shooter could roll 10 or more numbers, seven out and u would lose money!
  If you are on the dice table to pay bills…....u will lock in a profit…......believe me.  But some people just like the “action”.  Oh well.
good luck all….....keep ur discipline
kcadillac